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 Post subject: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 2:37 pm 
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Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:34 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Denver CO
I was reading a couple articles on Critiki News about tiki cultural sensitivity. This paragraph jumped out at me:

"As much as I love Tiki, there are expressions of it that make me cringe from a cultural sensitivity point of view. Personally, I tend to be particularly uncomfortable with sexualized distortions of hula. I also tend to cast a bit of side-eye at particularly cartoony takes on tiki carvings. But I’ve no doubt that my friends who embrace and engage in these very things have their own moments of cringing at the Tiki aspects that I embrace. We’re kinda the blind leading the blind here, stumbling through some tough terrain."

This might be unpopular, but I personally love "cartoony takes on tiki carvings." I love tiki art by Shag, Derek Yaniger and Shawn Dickinson. The more cartoony the better. And it's not just tiki. I love the outlandish "futuristic" hot rods made by Big Daddy Roth and George Barris. I like cheesy B horror, blaxplotation and Godzilla movies. I like zany bands like Man or Astroman, Los Straitjackets and Peelander Z. I like burlesque shows, the 3 Stooges and Tex Avery cartoons.

Where do you guys stand? Do you go for authentic tiki? Do cringe at kitschy tiki?


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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 3:18 pm 
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Manawale'a Avahata
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You could probably ask 100 different people and get 100 different answers!

I, too, love the Shag/Yaniger style art, and I know I have at least one tiki that's bright orange and pin-striped, hot rod style. So obviously it doesn't bother me.

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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 3:30 pm 
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Matato'a
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SqueakyTiki wrote:
I like cheesy B horror, blaxplotation and Godzilla movies. I like zany bands like Man or Astroman, Los Straitjackets and Peelander Z. I like burlesque shows, the 3 Stooges and Tex Avery cartoons.


We should hang out. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 3:44 pm 
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Matato'a
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I think you could divide your original post into two separate arguments ..if one were prone to argue about something like this...

1. The cultural sensitivity aspect.
2. The cartoony tiki thing.

People have criticized us for our lack of "cultural sensitivity" and "cultural appropriation".
To those people, I say quite simply, suck it.
There's not such thing as cultural appropriation ( not in the way that phrase is being hurled around today ).
It's an illusion. Just something people pretend they see in order to be sanctimonious about something they ( usually ) know nothing about.

And as for the cartoony tiki, Kristiki is right. You could ask 100 people and get 250 answers ( people like to give their opinions )
But, the only opinion that really matters, is mine.
And I say, meh.
That's right, meh.

I say meh because if you like it, than it's fine.
I love Shag's art and I love Crazy Al's carvings.
I love Brad Parker, Big Daddy Roth, P'Gosh and Wayne Coombs (RIP)
I love Squid ( the artist and the animal. Especially when it's fried up in those delicious little rings. )

What I don't love is people who think they have the right to "cast a bit of side-eye" about something that is essentially a fantasy.

That would be like someone criticizing me for using oak instead of maple on the dining room table of my 1/16th scale recreation of the Great Hall in Hogwarts.

Troll: "They don't have oak in Harry Potter!"
Me: "I feel bad for you".

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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 3:54 pm 
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Honui Moai
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Riptide wrote:
SqueakyTiki wrote:
I like cheesy B horror, blaxplotation and Godzilla movies. I like zany bands like Man or Astroman, Los Straitjackets and Peelander Z. I like burlesque shows, the 3 Stooges and Tex Avery cartoons.


We should hang out. :lol:
Clown tiki, too?Image

Sent from somewhere exotic

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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 5:06 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 22, 2018 10:31 am
Posts: 26
Location: Tampa, FL
Tiki Tony really floats my boat (he just did a jungle cruise tiki mug so that's a pun and you're welcome) and that's about as cartoony as it gets. Brings my love of tiki all the way back to my tiki-fueled imagination when I was a child.

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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 5:30 pm 
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Fellow Moai

Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 5:07 pm
Posts: 596
Location: Washington, DC
I'm 100% on board with Vee's comments!


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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 8:25 pm 
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Fellow Moai
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Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2017 3:19 pm
Posts: 372
Location: Bull City
Personal Statement: Leopard is a neutral.
Tiki Vee wrote:
I think you could divide your original post into two separate arguments ..if one were prone to argue about something like this...

1. The cultural sensitivity aspect.
2. The cartoony tiki thing.

People have criticized us for our lack of "cultural sensitivity" and "cultural appropriation".
To those people, I say quite simply, suck it.
There's not such thing as cultural appropriation ( not in the way that phrase is being hurled around today ).
It's an illusion. Just something people pretend they see in order to be sanctimonious about something they ( usually ) know nothing about.

And as for the cartoony tiki, Kristiki is right. You could ask 100 people and get 250 answers ( people like to give their opinions )
But, the only opinion that really matters, is mine.
And I say, meh.
That's right, meh.

I say meh because if you like it, than it's fine.
I love Shag's art and I love Crazy Al's carvings.
I love Brad Parker, Big Daddy Roth, P'Gosh and Wayne Coombs (RIP)
I love Squid ( the artist and the animal. Especially when it's fried up in those delicious little rings. )

What I don't love is people who think they have the right to "cast a bit of side-eye" about something that is essentially a fantasy.

That would be like someone criticizing me for using oak instead of maple on the dining room table of my 1/16th scale recreation of the Great Hall in Hogwarts.

Troll: "They don't have oak in Harry Potter!"
Me: "I feel bad for you".


:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 7:53 pm 
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Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:34 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Denver CO
Riptide wrote:
SqueakyTiki wrote:
I like cheesy B horror, blaxplotation and Godzilla movies. I like zany bands like Man or Astroman, Los Straitjackets and Peelander Z. I like burlesque shows, the 3 Stooges and Tex Avery cartoons.


We should hang out. :lol:


:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:


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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 7:54 pm 
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Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:34 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Denver CO
Tiki Vee wrote:
I think you could divide your original post into two separate arguments ..if one were prone to argue about something like this...

1. The cultural sensitivity aspect.
2. The cartoony tiki thing.

People have criticized us for our lack of "cultural sensitivity" and "cultural appropriation".
To those people, I say quite simply, suck it.
There's not such thing as cultural appropriation ( not in the way that phrase is being hurled around today ).
It's an illusion. Just something people pretend they see in order to be sanctimonious about something they ( usually ) know nothing about.

And as for the cartoony tiki, Kristiki is right. You could ask 100 people and get 250 answers ( people like to give their opinions )
But, the only opinion that really matters, is mine.
And I say, meh.
That's right, meh.

I say meh because if you like it, than it's fine.
I love Shag's art and I love Crazy Al's carvings.
I love Brad Parker, Big Daddy Roth, P'Gosh and Wayne Coombs (RIP)
I love Squid ( the artist and the animal. Especially when it's fried up in those delicious little rings. )

What I don't love is people who think they have the right to "cast a bit of side-eye" about something that is essentially a fantasy.

That would be like someone criticizing me for using oak instead of maple on the dining room table of my 1/16th scale recreation of the Great Hall in Hogwarts.

Troll: "They don't have oak in Harry Potter!"
Me: "I feel bad for you".



:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:


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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 8:00 pm 
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Tourist

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:34 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Denver CO
I agree with everything everyone here wrote. I think I've found my tribe. :D


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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 12:27 am 
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Fellow Moai
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Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:50 pm
Posts: 88
Location: Atlanta, GA
Personal Statement: I'm pro-metric.
Is tiki cultural appropriation? Maybe in its heyday, but not now. Tiki is really a fusion of all that is tropical - Polynesian, Caribbean, Latin, African, Asian, to the point it has become its own separate thing. It's definitely not some hipster or model wearing a Native American headdress trying to be boho-chic.

What got me into tiki was my love of all things 50s / 60s / 70s kitsch. And that snowballed, after I bought a mid-century modern home. As much as I'd love to decorate my home with all sorts of MCM named antiquities, I don't have the bank account for that. Plus, I don't want to live in a museum. I have 2 cats, and if they scratched up a $10,000 vintage couch, I'd be livid. That's why I have a crappy IKEA couch for <$1,000, so when it does eventually get too beat up, it's not a huge loss.

As I ventured into the world of mid-century modern furniture, the kitschy stuff definitely appealed the most to me. If it wasn't a named piece but fun with some groovy lines, and also affordable, I bought it. But I did get some side-eye from neighbors who are more MCM-purists. Which is great for them. They can live in that museum with furniture that you can't sit on. I'm going to go for fun instead.

Cartoony tiki can be alright. It does depend on the artist. Some of it skews in that fun folk-art kind of way, but some can be straight up juvenile looking - think some of the crappy Party City tiki decorations. Those decorations are OK for what they are, but they're not what I'd want to decorate my tiki bar with. Then again, if that's someone's personal tiki aesthetic, than who am I to disagree? There is no "tiki police" nor should there be one. Like what you like, and enjoy life.


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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 8:41 am 
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Matato'a
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Joined: Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:07 pm
Posts: 3643
kemika_popoki wrote:
There is no "tiki police"


Unfortunately there is.
But they are self appointed and nobody, aside from themselves, care what they have to say.
It's a real tiki boner killer having to deal with people like that.
But they are out there.

I have a drum bucket story that I think kind of puts this into perspective.
Wanna hear my drum bucket story?
Of course you do.

Years ago I was somewhere...can't remember exactly where....Key West I think.
And I was with some friends, two of whom are musicians.
We were standing there watching some kid play the "drums" on an old white plastic bucket.
Just some kid, banging away on a bucket on the corner of a street for change.

And this kid was good. Really good.
He wasn't Buddy Rich or Buddy Miles or even Buddy Hackett.
He was just a kid with two drum sticks, a bucket and some natural rhythm.

I'm standing there in awe. Mouth agape - in awe.
My one friend was also standing there amazed.
But my other two musician friends were standing there, critiquing this kids ability.
If he missed a note, they said something.
If he hit a flat sound, they guffawed.
Guffawed even!

They couldn't set their own snobbery and ego aside for an instant to simply enjoy what was.
The simplicity of it all was so far beyond them, all they could see was the pinpoint of light through the tunnel of their own asses.
And all I could think was "Get over yourselves. Look at all you're missing out on".

That's how I feel about people who thumb their noses at Party City tiki or things like Trader Vic's Beach Hut.

I don't have to be an accomplished musician to appreciate this kid wailing away on a bucket any more than someone else has to be Sven Kirsten to appreciate tiki.

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FOM MC- PRESIDENT
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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 4:38 pm 
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Fellow Moai
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 Post subject: Re: "Cartoony" Tiki
PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 7:44 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 7:26 pm
Posts: 26
So, there I was, in New Orleans, listening to the sounds of jazz and rock n roll drift through the air. I had a belly full of French food, and I was sipping a lovely rum made in Georgia by a Dutchman


Oh sorry, we were talking about cartoony tikis and the evils of cultural appropriation. Carry on :wink:


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